In Episode 87 of The Holistic Nutritionists Podcast, Natalie Douglas and Kate Callaghan discuss Kate’s perspective on her cancer patient journey and the natural cancer therapies she’s trying out.

• Kate’s trip to Hope 4 Cancer in Mexico
• Details on the Integrative + Natural Therapies Kate has been using so far
• Kate’s support crew of experts + everyday legends and why it’s important to approach it this way
• Food + Supplements to support her through overcoming Cancer and decreasing side effects of Chemo
• Dealing with the emotional aspect of this journey
• Kate’s tips for loved ones supporting someone through this journey 
• Resources Kate has found helpful along the way
• Where to next

• Radical Remission book
• The Journey healing method
• Hope 4 Cancer Mexico
• Oscar Juicer

Intro 0:00
Hello and welcome to The Holistic Nutritionists Podcast, with your hosts Natalie K. Douglas, Thyroid Healer, and Kate Callaghan, The Holistic Nutritionist. Nat and Kate are degree-qualified dietitians and nutritionists, certified fitness instructors, speakers, and authors. If you love unfiltered banter, unedited bloopers, and authentic heart-sharing, then we are your ladies! Now it’s time to sit back, relax, and get ready for our latest tips on living your healthiest life possible.

Natalie K. Douglas 0:36
Now, before we jump in I just wanted to remind you that this Thursday the 30th of January at 7:30 PM, I am hosting a free online masterclass, all about how to heal your thyroid naturally and reclaim your energy. I’m going to be sharing a bunch of super helpful information on how I approach thyroid healing with my clients, a few of the do’s and don’ts that I really feel like you need to know and that is whether you have been diagnosed with a thyroid issue, or if you just feel like you tick all of the boxes when it comes to symptoms. I’ve got you covered friends. So I’ll also be sharing a little bit more about my 10-week online program, Thyroid Rescue, and how you can join us for the next live round starting on February 9, which will include a super special early bird offer that you seriously don’t want to miss out on, just saying. So if that sounds like something that you’re interested in, or you know someone who has thyroid issues that could benefit from hearing this information, then please sign up via the link in my Instagram bio or by going directly to bit.ly/ThyroidRescue. So capital T for thyroid and capital R for rescue in that link. It will be recorded and the recording will be available for 48 hours only after the live masterclass. However, to access it, you have to make sure that you’ve signed up before January 30th. So go on and do that ASAP. Now, let’s go and chat to our beautiful Kate who I know you guys have missed as much as I have. Hey, guys, how are you? And hi Kate, that was the weirdest intro ever. But it felt weird saying welcome back to The Holistic Nutritionists Podcast because it feels like it’s a different kind of episode. So hi, welcome back. We missed you.

Kate Callaghan
That’s better, that’s better.

Natalie K. Douglas
Okay, I’m still gonna include the bad part cuz people know this about us. We missed you. We love you. How are you?

Kate Callaghan
I’m good. Today is a good day. I feel good. Yeah.

Natalie K. Douglas
Good. We’re glad. So we, I thought I would start off by just explaining to everyone that we thought this episode would be a really good opportunity for Kate to share with you how her journey has been so far in relation to operation beat breast cancer. And the reason that is is because so many of you were so incredibly generous and kind and compassionate, not just with your donations, but with your thoughts and your messages and your prayers and all of that kind of stuff. And, you know, as you can imagine, Kate’s had a lot and still has a lot on her plate. And it’s hard to get back to every single person. And so we thought we’d use this opportunity to give you a bit of an update because we know lots of you have been well I know lots of you have been asking Kate and myself, I get lots of clients and DMs about it as well. So we thought we’d create a space where you can come and listen to what’s been happening. Before we dive in, though, we do have to say that this is not intended to be medical advice and insert rest of fancy disclaimer here. Obviously, this is Kate’s experience. And that’s what we’re sharing any changes to what you’re doing or taking needs medical supervision, and yes, so please just don’t be silly. And just use this as as an update for Kate and what’s worked for her so far and what she’s doing and exploring. So, Kate, where we left off, I think was that people knew you were going to Mexico. And then after that, that was kind of it. So do you want to tell us a little bit about what happened in Mexico in and why you went there and what treatments you had done there?

Kate Callaghan
Sure. And also just before I forget about it, I just want to reiterate what you were saying about you know, we’re not providing that medical advice and I do highly encourage if anyone’s going through any kind of serious illness like cancer then to get a team of experts on board to help you. So I have my integrative doctor Tracy Turner, I have my oncology team down in the hospital, I have district nurses, I have doctors in Mexico who still check up on me, I have an oncology naturopath in Australia, and that’s just the start of my team. So I’m by no means doing this all by myself. And at all, I have a lot of people helping me to take some of that load off and to also make sure that I’m not doing the wrong thing, because it’s so easy to jump onto Instagram and someone say, you know, this supplement is amazing. And but you don’t know if let’s say if you’re doing chemotherapy, or if you’re taking other medications or even other supplements that that supplement could interact with your medications or anything else, or if you have any complications associated with the cancer. So you can have a primary tumor, which just sits there and kind of you want to get rid of it, but it doesn’t really do much but then you could have metastases, or you could have significant complications with. So for me with my liver, which prevents me from taking too many supplements, or going too hard with some things because it’ll put too much pressure on my liver and potentially making the situation worse. So yes, so just reiterating what Nat said, then don’t do this alone. Don’t just take Google’s word for it to get professional advice, please.

Natalie K. Douglas
Yes, agreed. Very well put, and I love how you like, expressing that you have a team because I do think that’s so important. And sometimes there’s this assumption that when you’re a health professional, and you’re going through something that you somehow do it alone, like, I just don’t think that’s the case. I think it’s good to be informed and to do your own research but there’s a point where you have to create a team around you because sometimes it just ends up being too overwhelming and it’s very hard to make decisions on your own when it’s about you and also when it’s something that you haven’t experienced before. So, yes, I a hundred percent agree.

Kate Callaghan
And I didn’t mention who my naturopath was if anyone’s interested. Her name is Shannon Carlin, and she’s based in Melbourne, her business is called The Naturopathic Balance and she’s an Oncology naturopath.

Natalie K. Douglas
Beautiful.

Kate Callaghan
Yeah. And that’s just the people looking after my physical well-being then I’m going to be looking after the mental-emotional side of things as well, counselor, psychologist. It’s full-time job, but that’s okay.

Natalie K. Douglas
Yeah.

Kate Callaghan
So where were we? So, Mexico. So I flew to Mexico at the start of December. Thanks to everyone who provided financial support. That was amazing. I know that not everyone gets the opportunity to go to Mexico for alternative cancer treatment because they can’t raise the funds to get there. I do encourage everyone to start an org, ask their friends to start a fundraiser to raise money, and you never know what could happen. I certainly didn’t expect to raise $235,000 in a week. That was, I have no words for that. It was overwhelming, humbling, but we have immense gratitude and we don’t really know how to express our thanks enough. But we do know that one day we will get back, one day, when I’m back on board. So I flew to Mexico and we were in Cancun and the clinic that I was at was called the Hope4Cancer, Mexico. I was in the outpatient clinic. So I sat across the road in a resort. It was a fabulous resort. It would have been amazing if I was there under different circumstances, almost threw a big tantrum at a drunk guy one day. Anyway.

Natalie K. Douglas
I would not like to be on the receiving end of your tantrum. I find you scary when you’re angry.

Kate Callaghan
It’s my crazy Gemini.

Natalie K. Douglas
Because you’re so beautiful and lovely. I think that happens with all really nice humans then when they’re angry I think I’m scary when I’m angry too, cuz usually I’m just so not. Anyway, that’s a totally first world sidetrack that keeps coming.

Kate Callaghan
I was just having an emotionally down day and I’m on the verge of breaking point. It was, I think because everything going over to Mexico was kind of just this whirlwind of awesome. I’m going to Mexico, I’m going to get this alternative treatment, and it’s going to be fabulous, and everything’s gonna be sorted, and life is gonna be peachy. And then three days into treatment. And these are long days of treatment of eight hours, six days a week of treatment. And yes, they’re nontoxic and noninvasive, but they’re still intense. And so three days into treatment I had this kind of realization of fuck, I’m getting treated for cancer. And this coincided with a really painful needle in my butt, which then pull me down this emotional cascade of crying, which led to hyperventilating. And then I went across the road back to my resort to go into my room, there’s this guy, trunk elevator is like, there’s just so many choices here. I don’t know what to do like, which pool diverse women, which restaurant do I eat, what drink do we have? Because it was all inclusive. Fuck you with the choices.

Natalie K. Douglas 10:31
Oh, yeah. I would feel just so the same.

Kate Callaghan
So, this is gonna be an explicit episode.

Natalie K. Douglas
That’s alright. Already noted.

Kate Callaghan
Okay, so treatments that we got on a day-to-day basis. So IV therapy was a big thing. So intravenous therapy was a big thing. So every second day, we got vitamin C infusions of about 25 grams. Before I left, my doctor, Dr. Tracy did some tests and I have a genetic mutation of G6PD, I think it is, which means I can’t actually go higher than 25 milligrams that 25 grams, sorry. Because I know people be screaming at the podcast going, you should be having more than that. This is another one of those intricacies of yeah, like, most people want to go 50, 60 grams, but my body can’t tolerate that amount. So I was doing 25 grams every second day. Every other day, we would do IV B17. I three times a week, I would also get IV Semi, so incidence of defining for my liver. So the vitamin C is for immune support, so it’s all based around immune support really because we’re all exposed to cancer, would just something goes awry with the immune system where we can’t fight it off. And that could be physical, mental, emotional. And so a lot of it was physical focus on boosting the immune system so vitamin C does that. When you’re over 10 grams of vitamin C, it also becomes a pro-oxidant so it starts to kill of those pathogens, kill off those cancer cells under 10 grams as an antioxidant. And, and then semi for my liver because my liver is a little bit creaky. It’s getting better. I can feel it’s getting better. I don’t have 24/7 nausea anymore, which is fabulous. What else did we do? We did hypothermia. So heat treatment was another big therapy for us. So when you’re heating the body, the ideal is you want to heat it a fair bit cuz heat kills off cancer cells as well.

Natalie K. Douglas
How hot was it?

Kate Callaghan
So the hypothermia, which they nicknamed the pizza oven, they were their goal was to get your cold body temperature to 40 degrees Celsius.

Natalie K. Douglas
Oh, sweet baby Jesus.

Kate Callaghan
Sweet baby Jesus, indeed. It’s horrible.

Natalie K. Douglas
So uncomfortable.

Kate Callaghan
Yeah, my skin looked amazing after a week.

Natalie K. Douglas
The glass is still half full, my friends. Hashtag cancer glow.

Kate Callaghan
I was sweating so much. And then also having all these juices and vegetables and swimming in the ocean. Getting vitamin C and the vitamin C makes you feel amazing. The first vitamin C I had like whoo, let’s do this. But yeah, so lots of sweat. It’s 40 degrees they come in and check on you all the time, every 5 to 10 minutes to take temperature to see where it’s at and to yeah, they don’t consult you at all. Like, can I get out? No.

Natalie K. Douglas
Can I ask why you’re crying because I would be crying?

Kate Callaghan
I didn’t cry in the heat treatment. I don’t think. No.

Natalie K. Douglas
That is the worst. I just I can’t stand being in pain or uncomfortable. I just cry.

Kate Callaghan
There were, there were many times when I just cried. People got used to me just sitting there crying and sometimes I didn’t know what I was crying about. I just sit there and just let the tears go and the head nurse, I said to him, am I of all the people you’ve had here am I the one who’s cried the most? I think it’s no, maybe the second.

Natalie K. Douglas
That was nice of you. I would definitely be, I would if I was there I would definitely have been a crier and probably more, more so.

Kate Callaghan
Yeah, yeah.

Natalie K. Douglas
But you know what? I think like there was so much kind of it all happened so quickly for you Kate and it was all like action action action, go go go go to get to Mexico, got to do the stuff, we have to plan, and then when you’re there it’s almost like all visit the emotion and the like adrenaline leading up to getting there is just so okay. So now reality is here. Now deal. Now deal with all the emotions so I can understand like, so you probably weren’t crying about nothing, you’ll probably crying about all of the shit that had come before that had finally had a chance to catch up with you.

Kate Callaghan
Yeah, and I definitely did have a fair lot, a lot of shedding tears before I left. Sorry about my language got partial chemo brain right now.

Natalie K. Douglas 15:23
Okay, we can deal with that.

Kate Callaghan
And but yeah, I think it was that that stopping, slowing down, and you know with IVs, you’d be sitting in a chair, or you might be doing your hyperbaric oxygen, where you lie in in a hyperbaric oxygen chamber for an hour. And it’s a lot of time to be with yourself and to start thinking, and I use that time, so the hyperbaric oxygen, so again, you want to oxygenate yourselves and to starve the cancer, kill off cancer. So hanging out actually really loved the hyperbaric oxygen chamber, most times, I would just go to sleep in it. But if I wasn’t sleeping, I would listen to, if anyone has the App Insight timer.

Natalie K. Douglas
I love that one.

Kate Callaghan
So good. So I do yoga nidra, like healing meditations, or sometimes, if I couldn’t be bothered doing all of the healing stuff, I just listened to a trashy podcast, like The Guilty Feminist.

Natalie K. Douglas
Oh, that podcast is funny.

Kate Callaghan
Yeah. But yeah, it’s a long time to be with yourself. So what else do we do? We did massage every day. I think that was more of a token gesture of they’re going through a lot, let’s do something nice for them. Come on keep going. And they actually use doTERRA essential oils, in their massage. And the emotional counselor used doTERRA essential oils as well, which was pretty awesome to see.

Natalie K. Douglas
Oh, that’s so nice.

Kate Callaghan
Acknowledged the good qualities.

Natalie K. Douglas
Yeah.

Kate Callaghan
And so from massage, who I would usually go into another treatment room where I would do something called INDIVA, which is another heat treatment. It’s kind of like a little ultrasound machine, but it’s heat. So it would be this little metal thing, heating up on over my breast, over my liver, and my underarms where all the cancer is at the moment. And so I would have a physical therapist with me and he’d be doing it for me, and also sometimes pushing me into as a forced Spanish lesson. As I was pinned to there half-naked, he would just say something in Spanish and wait for me to reply.

Natalie K. Douglas 17:42
I wonder what he was saying.

Kate Callaghan
I figure it, sometimes I figured out. He would tell me. He would tell but he was just, just gesting me. It was quite funny. I enjoyed it. And we’re doing INDIVA and then I would have a coffee enema. That’s where you get some nice warm mold-free organic coffee and you shove it up your butt and you hold it or you ideally hold it for 12 minutes, and then evacuate on the toilet, obviously, to help stimulate your liver and to help detoxify your liver and help with your colon cleansing. So a big focus also was on detoxification to, again support your liver get rid of any microbes, pathogens, parasites. And yes, a coffee enema every single day. And you were saying that you used to do coffee enemas?

Natalie K. Douglas
Yeah, when I had parasites back ages ago, and my poor mom was the first person that had to help me give myself a coffee enema. And it’s not like I was young, like I think I was about, well, maybe 20 or 21. And yeah, interesting experience, isn’t it? That sensation of holding something warm and stimulating? It’s like, it just feels like you’re holding a shit in the whole time. And you’re like this could go either way. And you try and move like, oh, wait a minute. I need to just stay in this position a little bit longer. So yeah, anyway, it’s not the greatest like, yeah.

Kate Callaghan
Sometimes I didn’t make it to12 minutes. I have read about people who get really just been good at doing coffee enemas, and they like to set themselves challenges. So they’ll do the lids at the coffee and they’ll get up and go for a walk somewhere or.

Natalie K. Douglas
Oh, that is that is playing with fire in my opinion. Because it’s not like I feel like it’s not the kind of evacuation you can control.

Kate Callaghan
No, it’s not.

Natalie K. Douglas
Send that first initial like message to your like, to your system that I felt something needs to release then it’s like it’s all out and it’s not. It’s not like a well-formed logout. It’s like yeah, it’s like.

Kate Callaghan
A warning nugget

Natalie K. Douglas 20:05
No, there’s no warning nugget. There’s no, like large deep plunk. It’s all just like, out and about.

Kate Callaghan
Right.

Natalie K. Douglas
So coffee enemas, everyone’s really excited. We actually, I don’t know if you you might not have listened to it Kate yet, but a few episodes ago, I interviewed Zhenya who’s a colon hydrotherapist here and we talked about coffee enemas. So if anyone wants to go back and learn more about that, go to that episode, because she talks through how to actually do one and the details in a bit more of the details in a bit more detail. You guys get what I mean.

Kate Callaghan
Fun times. Fun times.

Natalie K. Douglas
Very fun times. Anything else that you did?

Kate Callaghan
Yeah. So after that we, so after the coffee enema, we needed to then insert ozone rectally.

Natalie K. Douglas
Oh, does that hurt?

Kate Callaghan
No.

Natalie K. Douglas
Is it uncomfortable?

Kate Callaghan
No.

Natalie K. Douglas
Maybe. It’s really high. I think.

Kate Callaghan 21:02
I have to done a coffee enemas. Last thing you want to do is stick more things in your butt. But yeah, we did it. And then we did the two or three times a week, we would do something called UV BI, which was ultraviolet blood irradiation, where this is my least favorite one, where they draw out 100 mils of your blood, which is not much people who give blood regularly are just going that’s nothing. But for me who freaks out with, you know, the little blood tests where they take maybe six mils?

Natalie K. Douglas
Yeah.

Kate Callaghan
100 mils was a lot. So they take out 100 mils, they’d mix it with saylo, and then they’d run it through this UV machine to kill off microbes and pathogens. And then they would reinfuse it into your system. So that would essentially be cleansing your blood.

Natalie K. Douglas
Oh, how fascinating. Can you do that in Australia and New Zealand too or is that an exclusive to Mexico thing?

Kate Callaghan
I think that’s exclusive to Mexico.

Natalie K. Douglas 21:58
Sounds interesting.

Kate Callaghan
That’s one that I, the first time I did it, I always fainted. Second time I vomited, which they didn’t know what to do. I had to vomit in a bin because they don’t have buckets because no one vomits because they want to see therapies. Like what? What’s happening?

Natalie K. Douglas 22:14
Yeah, well, if you don’t like needles, or blood, of course, you’re gonna have that experience. Bowen would be the same if it makes you feel any better.

Kate Callaghan
I cried. And then I cried on every subsequent ones and I might have a couple of nurses just loitering around me just stroking me. It wasn’t even the the actual blood taking was me psyching myself out about it.

Natalie K. Douglas
Yep. Yeah.

Kate Callaghan
More of a mental thing than a physical thing. Actually ridiculous. So that’s right. What else did we do? I had some IV curcumin, some IV resveratrol, some IV EGCG, so Epigallocatechin gallate, which is an extract from green tea, lots of IV. So and they also put in a new candlelight every single day.

Natalie K. Douglas 23:03
Oh, wow, gosh, you really have stepped up your needle game and you’re out of you.

Kate Callaghan 23:08
I look like a junkie. It was perfect. And I think that’s about all that we did, vibration platform.

Natalie K. Douglas
Oh, interesting.

Kate Callaghan
A little bit of exercise in there as well.

Natalie K. Douglas
An exercise for blood flow or for oxygenation?

Kate Callaghan
Blood flow oxygenation. Yes. Yeah. And then we had emotional therapy as well. So we saw our counselor a few times while we were there.

Natalie K. Douglas
Yeah.

Kate Callaghan
And did some healing that way and visiting traumas in the past that might need to be addressed. That was a fun experience. Going back through my whole life and visiting traumas in my life, visiting traumas in my parents’ life, and working through forgiveness, and unconditional love. That was challenging. Challenging.

Natalie K. Douglas 24:01
I think that’s so amazing that they they did that though because I think stored trauma has so much power over, like our ability to fully heal and it’s one of those ones that we all kind of develop coping mechanisms around or, you know, ways around it but then once you open that can of worms, it can be really confronting, but I, I know when I’ve done that kind of work, that it feels exhausting and overwhelming in the moment and just like, oh, like all-consuming but then there’s almost like a little bit of a freedom once it’s out. Did you have any sense of that?

Kate Callaghan
Yeah, definitely. Definitely felt that really. There’s still a lot from working through and it’s a bit a while to work through. I saw Sha minerals over there as well which is really good.

Natalie K. Douglas
Oh, nice.

Kate Callaghan
And since I’ve been back, I have been seeing a Journey worker. Have you ever heard of Brandon Bays and The journey process?

Natalie K. Douglas
No. Tell me more.

Kate Callaghan
So Brandon Bays, she worked at Tony Robbins, actually, um, she’s a bit of a a healer. And so she had a basketball-sized tumor in her abdomen.

Natalie K. Douglas
Wow.

Kate Callaghan
Massive bleeding vaginally and the doctors were like, you’re going to die if we don’t operate straight away. And so she, I think she stopped the bleeding homeopathically, I think or another way. And then the tumor, she did this emotional release work which caused the tumor to over six weeks disappeared.

Natalie K. Douglas
Wow.

Kate Callaghan
Yeah.

Natalie K. Douglas
Isn’t it crazy? Like some of the the stories around like natural therapies. And that’s not to take away from the power of some conventional therapies as well. But I don’t know. There’s just there’s so much to mind-body medicine, in my opinion.

Kate Callaghan
Yeah, definitely.

Natalie K. Douglas
That’s fascinating.

Kate Callaghan
Created this whole process called the journey process, it was the emotional, emotional process and a physical process that you can go through that’s full on, so I often process once and it was three hours of kind of in this hypnotic state. Kind of.

Natalie K. Douglas
So do you do it under someone’s guidance? Is that what you mean?

Kate Callaghan
Yeah.

Natalie K. Douglas
Okay. And are there people that have like, done her training that you’d get it from?

Kate Callaghan
Yeah.

Natalie K. Douglas
Okay, we’re trying to find. Oh, cool.

Kate Callaghan
And she does retreats in sessions in Byron in Melbourne.

Natalie K. Douglas
Oh, I’m so looking this up, and I’ll put it in the show notes when I find it.

Kate Callaghan
It’s very worthwhile. But yeah, my session here was like three hours of crying. I’m shaking.

Natalie K. Douglas
I love crying, though. I love the release after it. That’s really fascinating.

Kate Callaghan
Yeah, and I think that’s kind of sums up the therapies that we did in Mexico.

Natalie K. Douglas
Mm hmm. And then what about diet and supplements, like where, where are you at there? And what kind of either, I don’t know things have you found yourself or advice you’ve been given from some of the practitioners that you’re working with, what’s happening there?

Kate Callaghan
So, also interesting fact. The reason why everyone should get their vitamin D tested. My vitamin D, I was deficient in vitamin D when I got to Mexico.

Natalie K. Douglas
Ah, interesting. What do you know what your level was?

Kate Callaghan
It was like 23.

Natalie K. Douglas
Oh, my gosh.

Kate Callaghan
Yeah. Yeah.

Natalie K. Douglas
Crazy.

Kate Callaghan
Wrong correlation between vitamin D and cancer. Vitamin D deficiency in cancer. So I got a 300,000 iu shot in the butt straightaway.

Natalie K. Douglas
Wow. That’s a big dose. Yeah. I’m forever checking clients vitamin D levels, because it is so common, like, rarely do I find clients and maybe it’s the population I’m working with, like most of the time, I’m working with people with thyroid, or autoimmune, or adrenal league stuff issues and, or hormone issues but I feel like most of the time, people might not be overtly deficient, but they’re definitely suboptimal like, and it’s so often not picked up either like I’ve had people have a vitamin D level of like 50. And to say nothing, which I consider that to be seriously deficient. Like I’m for me and my client population. I want their levels to be at least a 100, which is few and far between.

Kate Callaghan
100% yeah. Cost like it’s $40 to get tested but well worth it. So the vitamin D, we did iodine calls over there. Lugol’s like it’s five drops of Lugol’s iodine which a hefty dose of Lugol’s.

Natalie K. Douglas
Yes, it is. And people listening do not take high dose iodine unless you’re under the guidance of the practitioner because from a thyroid perspective, that can go very wrong. Kate’s in a different situation. So just reiterating that because I get asked that a lot.

Kate Callaghan
Yeah, don’t just don’t just take some things willy nilly.

Natalie K. Douglas
No.

Kate Callaghan
So, at the moment, what am I on? I’m on a lot at the moment. So vitamin D, sublingual liposomal, which also in the vitamin K too in it to help absorption and depositing that vitamin D in the right place where it’s meant to go. I am taking some B17, orally, so B17 capsules. I’m taking omega-3s. I’m taking some herbal supplements. So a few different herbal supplements. I am taking vitamin E, quercetin, ubiquinol. Again, these are all chemoprotective. And so when I go through chemotherapy, they’re going to protect my cells while I go through that process. I take a probiotic and immune support. I take akinesia. I take high dose liposomal vitamin C, high dose liposomal curcumin, I take broccoli sprout powder. So the sulforaphane in that is amazing for cancer, especially for hormone-dependent cancer, which mine is only dependent to breast cancer, estrogen, progesterone into positive to negative because I know some people going, tell me tell me what you have? Just because you know what I have doesn’t mean you should follow exactly the same thing that I’m doing. No. Mushrooms, so I’m taking multiple different mushroom formulas. I’ve got a liquid one, it has maitake, Reishi, turkey tail. And then I’m doing out in one in my morning coffee. And again, I know people are like, oh my God, just having coffee. Yes.

Natalie K. Douglas
Oh my god, we’re judging you now, why not?

Kate Callaghan
Yes, so I am having coffee once a day. It’s organic, mold free.

Natalie K. Douglas
Delicious, happy, inducing.

Kate Callaghan
Exactly but it has some oil. I have it with coconut oil in it. So a coconut oil is also really wonderful to support the immune system and with some evidence that shows that it can actually help mitigate some of the side effects associated with chemotherapy. And I will do anything for that. So, I put my mushroom powder in that as well. I also put in about five or six cardamom pods. I open them up and crack the seeds in there. So very.

Natalie K. Douglas
Does that taste disgusting?

Kate Callaghan
It’s delicious. I love it.

Natalie K. Douglas
Really?

Kate Callaghan
Yeah.

Natalie K. Douglas
I mean, I like it but I wouldn’t say I love it that much. What about some cinnamon to balance that out? Where you could.

Kate Callaghan
The reason why I put cardamom in there. It’s Cardamom has been shown to kill cancer stem cells. One of the issues with chemotherapy is yes, it can shrink tumors and kill cancer but it can’t actually kill the cancer stem cells. And unless you kill the cancer stem cells, you’re going to get a recurrence. So I need to also focus on doing everything they can to kill those cancer stem cells. He’s also really good for that. And but yes, my Cardamom coffee in the morning is delicious. I put one drop of stevia in it as well. So and blend it all up. It’s like a bulletproof coffee.

Natalie K. Douglas
Yum on steroids. It’s delicious.

Kate Callaghan
People with the deliciousness super powders in there. It’s so good, so good. I think that’s it. Oh, so take something called ribraxx, which is a bit gluten thing. And again, chemosensitizer and helps mitigate the side effects of chemotherapy. I have more greens powders. And then I have my mistletoe injections, which I inject into my breast.

Natalie K. Douglas
And you do that yourself?

Kate Callaghan
I do it myself. Yes.

Natalie K. Douglas
You go, girl. Look how far you’ve come.

Kate Callaghan
It’s a teeny teeny tiny needle. So I don’t.

Natalie K. Douglas
It doesn’t matter. You still got it still, it’s still progress. How good’s that?

Kate Callaghan
Do you know what was working really well? I would go for it’s here it’s beautiful at the moment. I would go for a swim in the lake and like it’s freezing cold. Go for good swim, get my boobs nice and numb. So and inject you could just deal with ice cube.

Natalie K. Douglas
Yeah, you missed out on the deliciousness that is the New Zealand lakes.

Kate Callaghan
Exactly, exactly. And so yes, I inject is it or mistletoe into my breast two to three times a week and that is supportive of helping to reduce the tumor size, reduce cancer cells, but also to again mitigate mitigate those side effects of chemotherapy. I have another injection, which Aaron gives me into the arm, and that’s called as angina and it’s more of an immune support one that he gives me and that’s a few times a week. And I think, I think that’s it. It’s pill fatigue is real.

Natalie K. Douglas
I know you’ve have a newfound appreciation for when you prescribe supplements.

Kate Callaghan
I know, and it’s really challenging, because so I know, on the diet front so the biggest thing for my type of cancer is intermittent fasting.

Natalie K. Douglas
Right.

Kate Callaghan
And so I am doing 16/8 fasting. And again, this is not to say that everyone should fast 16 hours, although there is some research that 13 hours or more can minimize the risk of getting breast cancer, so 13 or 14 hours at it. So if you have any hormone issues like hypothalamic amenorrhea, we wouldn’t usually recommend fasting for a long period overnight, you might want to just do 13 hours to prevent these sorts of things, so giving you a system break overnight but I did 16 hours. And so then I have to cram everything into eight hours which is it’s challenging getting all this supplements in because they can fill you up. So I always have them after my meal because food is the most important thing for me at the moment for not just nutrition but for calories. So I have lost a fair amount of weight of last couple of months. And, and so a big priority for me is restoring that weight because in this game with the big C, you really don’t want to lose weight. So I need to back myself up a little bit.

Natalie K. Douglas
So are you still doing keto or something similar to that? Were you doing that?

Kate Callaghan
I was but it was too challenging and you need to do it. No. What I need to do is put weight on at the moment and also support my liver and if I go keto, it’s probably too much fat for my liver at the moment. I’m not going no fat. I think that’s crazy. But at the moment, I’m going lower carb so still quite low carb. I don’t go nuts on eating all sorts of carb-y things. I really have sweet potato I might have one chunk, like one little piece of potato with Aaron cooking them. But yeah, it’s more low carb than than keto throughout the day. And so, I’ll usually get, I kind of try and continue to eat in those eight hours to make sure I get enough in, yeah. I’m mostly plant-based. Yeah. Hashtag plant-based.

Natalie K. Douglas
No judgment. We love you. Well, I feel like I feel like eating mostly plants is what we’ve said all along anyway, but we’re just. Yeah, I get what, what you’re saying.

Kate Callaghan
I’m gonna go get that through our podcast and like say, hold on. You said we shouldn’t do intermittent fasting. Hold on.

Natalie K. Douglas
Yeah, I know. Context matters people.

Kate Callaghan
I have cancer.

Natalie K. Douglas
Yeah.

Kate Callaghan
So I do. So mostly plant-based, mostly mostly vegan throughout the day. Well, in saying that, one of the supplements that I forgot to mention, I take lots of pills everyday time you’re not vegan.

Natalie K. Douglas 37:18
Sorry, it seems like such a contrast. But yes, that’s awesome. Okay.

Kate Callaghan
Vegan that’s for the liver that I get to use.

Natalie K. Douglas 37:27
We’re not being offensive anyone, that’s laughing. It’s just a very interesting contrast. Yes. So okay, and then do you, so if you’re mostly plant-based. So besides the liver or do you eat any animal products at the moment, like any seafood or, or is it literally just the the liver like, how are you getting any? Are you having much protein or are you trying to reduce that?

Kate Callaghan
Yeah, probably not as much as I used to, but still getting it in. My biggest focus is veggies, and fat, little bit of carbs. I have some fresh fruit, I got stone fruit seeds in here and it’s friggin amazing and brings me so much joy. I don’t go nuts in the fruit. It’s amazing. And what was the question? There we go. Chemo brain.

Natalie K. Douglas
Um, are you having much protein and then.

Kate Callaghan
Oh, yeah, protein. So fish, I might maybe have once a week. Yeah, I feel like it might be some wild-caught salmon maybe. So in Mexico, they said I could have organic chicken, or organic red meat once a week, and often don’t feel like it though. So I do tend to mostly stick to my liver pills. I do have some marine collagen powder which sometimes I’ll have. Eggs they advise me to stay off for a few months and so.

Natalie K. Douglas
Did they say why?

Kate Callaghan
They did some hair mineral analysis and it just one of the potential food intolerances that came up with me.

Natalie K. Douglas
Okay.

Kate Callaghan
That’s what they advise me to stay off in three months.

Natalie K. Douglas
Yeah.

Kate Callaghan
Which is kind of heartbreaking.

Natalie K. Douglas
Yeah, you do you do love your banana pancakes.

Kate Callaghan
In saying that, so a few weeks ago, I have a couple of bites so the kids banana almond before I all the kale fully rolls, and it just didn’t do it for me anymore.

Natalie K. Douglas
Yeah. Yeah.

Kate Callaghan
I’m really listening to my body. Yesterday, I made some beetroot and hemp burgers.

Natalie K. Douglas
Oh, yum.

Kate Callaghan
Delicious.

Natalie K. Douglas 0:03
Did you make up the rest of yourself? What did you have? Did you find a recipe?

Kate Callaghan
I did not make up the recipe myself.

Kate Callaghan 0:12
My friend, Jess Anderson, she’s Wellness by Jess for the instance. She gave me a book by Luke Hines. Luke Hines.

Natalie K. Douglas
Yeah, I do. Well, not personally, but I know what you’re talking about.

Kate Callaghan
Luke Hines and Scott Gooding, MasterChef guys.

Natalie K. Douglas
Yep.

Kate Callaghan
He has a book called eat more vegan.

Natalie K. Douglas
Yeah.

Kate Callaghan
And it was a lot of delicious recipes in there. And so.

Natalie K. Douglas
Awesome.

Kate Callaghan 0:34
It was a beetroot, your beetroot, and hemp burger with a lot of vegan mayonnaise.

Natalie K. Douglas
Hmm. Interesting.

Kate Callaghan 0:47
Even, so Olivia loved it. This is the best mommy. Aaron said shit, this is good.

Natalie K. Douglas 0:51
That’s awesome. Yep. Yeah. Cool. And then what about juicing, are you doing juicing?

Kate Callaghan
I am. So again, if you’re going keto, it’s gonna make it very hard to juice.

Natalie K. Douglas
Yeah.

Kate Callaghan
And juicing, it’s a good way to give your digestive system a little bit of a break, but still getting those nutrients in. And at the moment, I have something called ascites, which is a complication associated with cancer. And it’s mostly at the moment, it’s due to my liver and the hypertension or high pressure in my liver. And so, I can’t drink a lot of plain water. Which sucks because I love water. If I drink too much plain water by itself, my belly is going to swell up with a whole lot of fluid that will eventually have to get drained off by the hospital, which is not a comfortable process. So I have had it done once, they drain five liters of my tummy and it was horrible.

Natalie K. Douglas
Yeah, I can imagine. So what are your juice?

Kate Callaghan
So, the carrot juice. If I have carrot juice, carrot ginger, turmeric, lemon. That’s a good way to get to rehydrate, get fluids in, I can have coconut water as well without making the fluid accumulate too much in my tummy.

Natalie K. Douglas
And is it just because it’s more balanced from an electrolyte point of view that that works?

Kate Callaghan
Yeah.

Natalie K. Douglas
Cool. Interesting. So do you have a juicer?

Kate Callaghan
I do have a juicer. I’ve got one called Oscar.

Natalie K. Douglas
The what?

Kate Callaghan
Oscar cold-pressed juicer.

Natalie K. Douglas
Okay, cool.

Kate Callaghan
And I thought it was just cold-pressed juicer. And when I got it I was reading the manual, it’s like and here’s how you make ice cream.

Natalie K. Douglas
Oh, stop it.

Kate Callaghan
What?

Natalie K. Douglas
Is it difficult to clean? Because that’s my beef with with juicing? Is it.

Kate Callaghan
No. So, I wasn’t going to get a juicer because I was that fuck that. I remember when I was 16.

Natalie K. Douglas
Yes.

Kate Callaghan
Juicing and I just didn’t know how to clean anything but this one’s super easy. It’ll just pull out really easy and very simple to wash.

Natalie K. Douglas
Okay, and have you found a way yet because I’ve tried when I’ve like here and there done a bit of juicing to create something out of the pulp that comes out because I hate food waste. But every time I’ve tried to do something, it’s failed miserably. Have you managed to make anything taste good?

Kate Callaghan
I have. I made some bliss bowl, I’ve posted the recipe.

Natalie K. Douglas
Oh, yes. I did see a food photo. I’ve missed them. It’s so good.

Kate Callaghan
It’s so good, and then I made a cake. I can’t remember the recipe for that. But I’ll try it again because I’m still getting the most pulp. Today, I’m going to try and make some crackers I think.

Natalie K. Douglas
Okay. All right.

Kate Callaghan
Adding some seeds and things and.

Natalie K. Douglas
Keep those posted because I feel like that’s like I’m not against people juicing like vegetable juicing. I’m not a fan of fruit juicing. But the only thing I I yeah, like sometimes I’m like, I feel a bit guilty about it if I do it because I haven’t found a way to use the pulp properly. And I think oh, this is good. This is still delicious food. So that’s great. You’ve found a way. I’m definitely going to go and stalk your Instagram and also keep us posted because I feel like there would be other people out there listening that do like doing some juicing here and there and probably struggle with the same issue of like seeing that pulp and being like, what do I do? Once I just tried to eat it isn’t that bad? And I couldn’t do it. I was like, it was it was I think it was celery and something else and I was like, oh my god, I can’t, I can’t do it.

Kate Callaghan
Well, you need to try.

Natalie K. Douglas 4:16
I know. I felt like a true wellness warrior try and then I just add to a baby did a tablespoon and almost gagged. I don’t recommend doing that.

Kate Callaghan
If you go onto my Instagram and find the bliss bowl recipe it’s not from very long ago, maybe two weeks ago. Have a look through the comments. It’s on my Facebook as well, have a look through the comments because there’s heaps of people who have found even more extraordinary ways or just google, google it juice pulp juice pulp prep.

Natalie K. Douglas
I’m sure there are plenty of people out there doing that. Okay, cool. And what, like any movement that you’re doing? So like obviously there’s a desire not to lose any more weight but also this opposite desire of like, well oxygenating, your body is of benefit. How are you balancing that or is it just like a day-by-day thing that you’re taking as it comes?

Kate Callaghan
Definitely, day-by-day. So the days post hemorrhoid feel rubbish. So it’s very, very gentle movement, if any, in those. It was even though more movement would be better. So if you can force yourself to do it, it is actually going to be better for you to help detoxify the system and help decrease some of those negative symptoms if you can find something that you love but mostly yoga at the moment, so I go to hot yoga fusion here in Wanaka with Nikki, and I love it. And so that’s kind of multitasking for me because it’s movement. It’s really nourishing my body, and that’s heat.

Natalie K. Douglas
And it’s also being around people, which is probably important as well at the moment sometimes.

Kate Callaghan
Correct. So, a lot of people do cry when they see me.

Natalie K. Douglas
Yeah. How do you handle that? Because that would be hard, because there’s kind of yeah, how do you? How do you handle the whole people treating you somewhat differently even if they’re trying? I’m sure some people are trying not to, but it’s would be difficult as well, at the same time, like, how do you, do sense that and how do you deal with it?

Kate Callaghan
I just tell them, I’m gonna be fine. I can move on.

Natalie K. Douglas
Yeah.

Kate Callaghan
I mean, at the moment, I’m seeing a lot of people who I haven’t seen for a long time. So we do just talk about what I’ve been doing.

Natalie K. Douglas
Yeah.

Kate Callaghan
But then there’s some people who haven’t seen me since my diagnosis. And they were right start with and then they start crying. And it’s, I understand it, we have, I have them. That’s big time. And then I might start crying as well because I’m a sympathy crier.

Natalie K. Douglas
Same, I’m so bad. I have to bite my tongue sometimes on one-on-one client calls. Have you ever had to do that where someone.

Kate Callaghan
No, I can’t.

Natalie K. Douglas
Oh, I mean.

Kate Callaghan
Very unprofessional.

Natalie K. Douglas
Yeah, I have. I’m not gonna lie. I have cried a number of times. But sometimes I try and just like bite my tongue because I know, I’m definitely one of those. And what about like, where to from here? So you’re doing chemotherapy at the moment? Is it once a week for how many? How many more weeks?

Kate Callaghan
Once a week for 11 more weeks.

Natalie K. Douglas
And then do they retest or where? How do they assess? And when do they assess what’s happened?

Kate Callaghan
So I got some CT scans when I was in Auckland hospital, because I’m on my way back from Mexico. I vomited before I left. That was fun. So then I was in hospital for a week. Anyway, they did a whole lot of scanning on me to see what was going on. So I need to get those CT reports, because it looks like my liver is actually in better shape than they initially thought. And if it is, with less metastases, then they might be able to operate on my liver, which would be fabulous, because the liver can regenerate. I mean, I don’t want surgery, obviously. But if you can get rid of the metastases in my liver, then things are looking up. And so from here, so I got chemo weekly for 12 weeks, but one week were done so 11 weeks to go.

Natalie K. Douglas
Yay!

Kate Callaghan
Yay! And I have a follow-up oncology appointment in a few weeks actually. Compare CT scans, I’ll get I’ll ask for CT scans halfway through.

Natalie K. Douglas
Yep.

Kate Callaghan
To see and we’ll talk about markers that we’re going to assess. I’m going to request tumor markers because they didn’t really do that here. But it’s I think it’s important to test those tumor markers to I mean, otherwise, what do you, what are you basing it on?

Natalie K. Douglas
Yeah, totally.

Kate Callaghan
You want to see if it’s working or not just oh, we’re just gonna keep going just for the fun of it.

Natalie K. Douglas
Yes.

Kate Callaghan
It was pretty, pretty hardcore.

Natalie K. Douglas
Yeah.

Kate Callaghan
It’s not the most fun thing.

Natalie K. Douglas
No, no, it doesn’t sound like very much fun. And what about so I know that people have asked us questions. So I’m just going to ask for the sake of answering everyone’s question. What where are we at with having mastectomy like, because the question I know has been asked you well, why don’t you just get your boobs removed?

Kate Callaghan
Yeah. So that would be, it would seem logical to do that. So the thing is, at the moment, my breast, my underarm where there’s lymph nodes affected, they’re not causing any issues at all. It’s my liver that’s causing issues that if I was to do nothing, things would go downhill rapidly. So if and that they’re in their eyes, with what the scans have shown in the past, my livers covered in metastases at the moment, so it’s not in a position to be operated on, which is why we’re going down all of these other treatments first to see if we can shrink things down. If they can operate on the liver if it just stays how it is and just continues to shoot itself. Getting a mastectomy is just kind of like getting a surgery just for the fun of it. It’s, it’s not going to change anything for me in.

Natalie K. Douglas
Got you.

Kate Callaghan
So yeah, with the main priority is liver, so kind of, kind of if you had two holes in a pipe, and then you had a really big one that was kind of gushing out all this water. But then you had the small one, which was there first and going, we need to patch up that little one first because it was first. So we reckon that one could have triggered the other one. No, you need to address the one that’s got any cause that is causing the biggest issues first. So stabilized liver, operate on liver, once that’s sorted, then yes, mastectomy if it looks like it is going to be a good option.

Natalie K. Douglas
Hmm. Okay. Well, that makes more sense because I know that a lot of people are thinking, oh, well, you have breast cancer, why don’t you just remove your breast? So that explains that side of things and makes a lot more sense.

Kate Callaghan
I wanted to.

Natalie K. Douglas
Yeah, I remember.

Kate Callaghan
Fixed to December, we were booked to have a mastectomy and then I think it was the 18th of November. This was, it was the 20th they said a CT scan showed you got metastases on your liver. And at first it was like, oh, that’s fine because the liver can regenerate. I said, let’s just operate in the liver. And they said no, we can’t. That would be taking too much of your liver and it won’t regenerate. You need a certain amount of your liver left to regenerate.

Natalie K. Douglas
Yeah.

Kate Callaghan
No, we can’t operate on it anymore. And that was the downhill.

Natalie K. Douglas
Yeah.

Kate Callaghan
We’re sorry. We can’t do anything. Shit, shit, shit, shit, shit.

Natalie K. Douglas
Yes, yes, but we can. And I think I think you know, you’re just you’re doing amazing with integrating all of this different stuff. And what a great example of like conventional, and natural medicine, and individualized medicine. And I just think it’s like, I feel really lucky that you’re sharing it with us because I know with sharing also comes people who are judgmental, I’m sure or triggered. And I really, like I’m proud of you for being like well, screw all of you people that are going to be like that, you know, this information is important. And so often, we shy away from talking about cancer or hard things or controversial things. And it’s really great that you’re sharing what’s working for you, or at least what you’re trying because it’s all about knowledge and knowing what your options are. And then as you said at the beginning, like finding a support crew to guide you through that. And it like, is there anything else that you want to share with people? Like is there any advice you have for either people going through a similar journey so far, or even like messages to people who want to support you, but aren’t sure how to do it? Maybe let’s start with the first one. Is there anything, any advice you have to people who are going through a similar journey?

Kate Callaghan 13:23
If you’re going through cancer journey, there’s some things that I would recommend. And one thing was a book fit. My integrative Dr. Tracy Chandler recommended, and it’s called Radical Remission. Especially if you have stage four cancer, get that in your ears or get the hardcopy, read it, listen to it, read all of it, listen to it again, it is so empowering. It’s basically full of stories of people in the worst of the worst situations with cancer. And they managed to heal themselves either naturally or with a combination of conventional and natural treatments. So that’s a very, very empowering book, get it in your ears straightaway. On that, so if you get this diagnosis or whatever diagnosis of cancer you get no matter what stage. Your initials, so I think with cancer people go, okay, it’s a death sentence. So how long have I got? That’s the next question they say to their doctor. And the doctor will pull out some random number based on maybe statistics, maybe just on their individual practice experience. Don’t ask that question. I would say do not ask how long have I got? And I would in fact say, I don’t want to talk about prognosis at all and just assume that you’re going to make it through because it can break you and you can go into this dark hole. And unless you’re strong enough to pull yourself out of that, if you stay in that hole, then you will probably go with that prognosis. Hope that makes sense. I know that sounds really horrible but if you bind to it too much, if you tell your head, okay, this is what I’ve got. They said I’ve got three months, and I’ve got three months.

Natalie K. Douglas
Yeah, well, I mean, what we like, as cliche as it sounds like, a lot of the time at like, our mind is so powerful, like we create our reality in a lot of senses. And that’s not to say that shitty things like don’t just happen, but I so believe that like there’s a healing mindset that comes with whether it’s cancer or some other diagnosis. I agree with you wholeheartedly. And I don’t think that you know, this is I think it’s good coming from someone who’s in it, because otherwise, it’s too easy to be like, oh, well, you don’t understand how hard it is. And I know that you’ll be the first person to say, it’s fucking hard to continue to pick yourself back up and stay in that mindset. But what I’m hearing you say is, what other option do you have? Because if you don’t commit to healing and commit to recovering, then essentially you’re bowing down to the other option, which you know.

Kate Callaghan
Yeah.

Natalie K. Douglas
Yeah.

Kate Callaghan
And, and, you know, the doctors will say, especially with stage four, there’s no cure for this. What that means is they don’t know how to cure it, or there is not yet a cure for it. But there are trials and a lot of research going on every single day. Some might be drugs that can just extend your life a little bit longer until we get to that point where eventually we will, we will know the cure. And I don’t think it’s that far away.

Natalie K. Douglas
Yeah.

Kate Callaghan
It’s just in the meantime, buy in time, getting yourself there, because there’s you gonna have the hope. You always have the hope. When you lose hope, you lose everything.

Natalie K. Douglas
Yeah, I so agree with that. And what about, like people who want to help you, Kate, like, how whether it’s the way they treat you, whether it’s things they do, whether like, what is it that you’ve, you are finding most helpful at the moment, because I’m sure that other people going through the same thing, maybe finding similar things helpful. And I think that loved ones around and people that perhaps don’t know you, but are touched by your story, and maybe have someone that is in their life that’s going through something similar are in this position, where you’re like, well, shit, I don’t know what to do. And I want to be helpful. But I, yeah, it’s it’s not something that’s easy to process as someone who is in the support crew. So as someone who’s in the trenches of it, what are you finding most helpful from your friends, your family, and people that are just, you know, in your, in your circle, what’s most helpful?

Kate Callaghan
Normality. Keeping things normal, I have pretty awesome friends who just like, it’s it’s just day-to-day life. It’s normal, as usual, we don’t really talk about what’s going on too much. We’re a little bit but not too much. So I think normality is really important because your, your whole world will get consumed by the treatment, whatever path of treatment, you go down, your life will get consumed by it. So just having that sense of formality, talking about other things, other than cancer all the time is so so important. And don’t give them sad eyes. Sad eyes are the worst. Like looking at them as if they’re going to die and having that pity look, they are the worst. Please don’t do that.

Natalie K. Douglas
Yeah, yeah. Try and catch yourself out, because I’m sure people do it unintentionally. So I think hearing this heartfully as a reminder of all of that, because it would be it would be hard not to because that’s your first reaction, I think if someone who hears bad news because you don’t know what to do and our nature as humans is to want to fix it when we can’t fix it. A lot of the time, you know, that that’s what can happen. So I hear you in that and I, I so I so get you in terms of just wanting normality, because you want to also feel like they’re making that they are hopeful and that their assumption is also that well, this is a really shitty time, but you’re going to be here forever anyway, so you know.

Kate Callaghan
Exactly. Exactly, what you just said. That sucks. It’s really shit but you’re going to be okay. That’s what you need to say, like acknowledge the shittiness. But then say, you’re gonna do this, it’s going to be fine. And just believe that it is. It might not. It might not. But there’s no point living our life every single day going, it’s not going to be okay because you do have three months, then fuck make the most of it.

Natalie K. Douglas
Yeah. Put as much cardamom in your coffee as you want.

Kate Callaghan
Fuck yeah. Put that cardamom. And the other big thing that’s been really, really helpful is meals. I’ve got some really good friends here who have cooked food for me quite a bit and it’s so so helpful. And cleaning up the mess is amazing, and gardening as well. I have an incredible community here in Wanaka, who are about to do our landscaping, which is just that blows me away but also our neighbor comes up in Moselle lawns as well.

Natalie K. Douglas
So, nice. What a beautiful support crew?

Kate Callaghan
Ah, far out. This community that I live in is just unbelievable. And yeah, that’s some big tips probably and then just holding space and positive vibes, praying, whatever works for you. Yeah. Cuz you feel that energy? I felt that energy through December.

Natalie K. Douglas
Yeah, I can imagine. I mean, I felt it and I’m not you. I just felt like, you know, what a shitty thing but what an amazing display of people coming together, donating whatever they could, whether it was thoughts, whether it was money, whether it was time, whatever, like that the power of that was so moving to see and I’m sure you felt that. And I think, not always like, there wouldn’t be words that you could say that would do all of that justice. But I think every one of and I’m totally just not speaking for my but I feel like so many of us felt that and just like, wow, that’s awesome because it’s a display of what yeah, everyone doing something can do. And I know that when all of this shittiness is over, that you and as and you know, we’ll just create something amazing from this to give back and to create more impact. But it’s so nice that you’ve been able to have the roles reversed for a little while and people being like, okay, well, now’s your turn to be supported by all these people that you’ve touched in some way. So I love that.

Kate Callaghan
Pretty amazing.

Natalie K. Douglas 22:47
Pretty freakin cool.

Kate Callaghan
Pretty freakin cool. Yeah. It’s hard sometimes.

Natalie K. Douglas
Oh, it is but amazing. Just amazing. So is there anything else before we wrap up that you want to share? I mean, I think in terms of giving people updates, to be honest, I think we’ll probably just play it by ear is that your, your kind of instinct there. Like when we feel like there is an update to give, then we will provide you with more updates. How do you feel about that?

Kate Callaghan
Continuing with everything that I’m doing at the moment?

Natalie K. Douglas
Yeah.

Kate Callaghan
A few weeks, it’s gonna be fun.

Natalie K. Douglas
Look, you have an amazing face. And I think you’re just gonna rock that so.

Kate Callaghan
Yeah, some people have mentioned about the cold caps.

Natalie K. Douglas
What?

Kate Callaghan
So you can have cold caps, you can wear cold caps during your treatment. It’s like a freezer so it gives you an ice cream headache for a solid few hours while you’re in treatment but it extends the time that you’re at the hospital. It’s painful and it only works 50% of the time. And I honestly I can’t be bothered that I don’t want to go through any more pain. I don’t want to extend the time that I’m at the hospital.

Natalie K. Douglas
No, girl, you’ve got you’ve got a good head. We can do this.

Kate Callaghan
I will wear some nice scarves, so I’ve been sent a beautiful scarf from the company Bravery Co.

Natalie K. Douglas
Yeah.

Kate Callaghan
Go and see out in Instagram. She’s beautiful human.

Natalie K. Douglas
I love it.

Kate Callaghan
I will rock that when the time comes.

Natalie K. Douglas
You will, you will, you will. I have no doubt, you are going to be the most attractive, bold scarfed lady on the gram.

Kate Callaghan
Probably was telling me that apparently people will try and fill your head when you’ve got a bald head.

Natalie K. Douglas
Oh, well, yeah, I would try and do that. You’re lucky. I’m not there because I am. Oh, yes, I can confirm I am one of those people.

Kate Callaghan
If anyone sees me in the real life, and you’re listening, please don’t rub my bald head.

Natalie K. Douglas 24:40
If I see you I’m still going to rub your bald head. You said not to treat you any differently.

Kate Callaghan
No, just don’t do it.

Natalie K. Douglas
It’s like when people are pregnant that you don’t know. And you rub their belly. I do that.

Kate Callaghan
When you see at the market, random people come up rub your belly.

Natalie K. Douglas
Yeah.

Kate Callaghan
You know.

Natalie K. Douglas
Yeah, I did that and one lady really got on a bit a bit unhappy with me. So now I try not to do it unless I know them well, but I, so I can’t. You know when you’re you’re young and your parents say don’t touch that and you’re like, oh, if I just touch it a little bit that’s me with bald heads and pregnant bellies so.

Kate Callaghan
Pregnant bellies do kind of draw you in though, like oh, but it look so good. I just want to rub it. It’s like a little bit of belly.

Natalie K. Douglas
Yeah, but sort of bald heads. You’ll say you’ll rub your own bald head.

Kate Callaghan
Well, I’m allowed to rub my own bald head.

Natalie K. Douglas
It doesn’t seem fair if we can’t rub it. You’re like, so Nat, you’re not coming to visit?

Kate Callaghan
No, when my hair grows back.

Natalie K. Douglas 25:43
That’s funny. That’s fair enough. Fair enough. All right, cool. Well, we’ll keep people posted as we feel like you want to and we can and otherwise. Yeah, just share as you want on the gram. I’m sure that’s you know when you feel like you want to do that you will otherwise hopefully everyone has gotten something out of listening. And if you have questions then please send them through but know that the answers to those may or may not come soon like we’re just as I said, gonna play it by ear and see how the responses to this podcast and also just how Kate’s feeling. And yeah, any any final words for today, Kate?

Kate Callaghan
No final words for me, any from you?

Natalie K. Douglas
Nope. That is all. So, we will, I guess speak to you all soon.

Outro
Thanks for tuning in to The Holistic Nutritionists Podcast. Remember, we love to make the show relevant to you. If you have any questions or topics you’d like us to discuss, just submit them to [email protected] and we’ll get them answered for you. Also, don’t forget to subscribe, rate, and review the podcast on iTunes and share it with your friend. And if you’re looking for more info about how we can accelerate your journey to your optimal health, you can find me, Nat, over at NatalieKDouglas.com, and Kate, at TheHolisticNutritionist.com. See you next time!